Greg interviews Steve Jasmin, of SC3 in the first episode where the is not directly a fund manager, but rather an asset manager and merchant banker.
Steven Jasmin grew up in the United states, graduated from Emory University’s Business School, and immediately built a management consulting business providing advice to fortune 500 companies such as Delta Airlines, Coca Cola, and Johnson and Johnson. Around 2010 he pivoted towards advising Offshore Oil and Gas dynasties in both their business efficiencies as well as their investments, and ultimately became a Chief Restructuring Officer for several of his clients.
Today Steve spends his time in Guyana, focused on growth opportunities largely related to the Offshore Oil discoveries made since 2015. He has built several companies to help provide value and impact to the Guyanese people, and investors that want to participate in the country’s growth.
A transcript of the interview can be found below:
FUND VIEW$ Podcast
Episode 06: Steven Jasmin Sc3
Greg Poapst: Welcome back to another episode of fund views podcast. I'm your host Greg pops today; we're deviating from the usual program of fund managers to talk with an asset manager and merchant banker focused on building infrastructure in Guyana. Steven Jasmin grew up in the United States, graduated from Emory University’s business school, and immediately built a management consulting business, providing advice to fortune 500 companies, such as Delta airlines, Coca-Cola and Johnson and Johnson around 2010. He pivoted towards advising offshore oil and gas dynasties in both their business efficiencies as well as their investments. And ultimately he became a chief restructuring officer for several of his clients today. Steve spends his time in Guyana, focused on growth opportunities, largely related to the offshore oil discoveries made since 2015 is built several companies to help provide value and impact to the guy needs people and investors that want to participate in the country's growth. Good afternoon, Steve thanks for jumping on the podcast and fun views supporting this endeavor of mine. Uh, so I guess to start, if you can just introduce yourself and, and start at the beginning, you know, where did you grow up and how'd you become interested in finance and banking?
Steven Jasmin: Sure. Yeah, I, thanks for having me, you're doing a great job with this and I'm really excited to be a part of it. You know, just like your podcast. Guyana is a new and emerging economy and country. That's one of the world's most new oil producing nations. And so it's exciting to be able to share the story a bit. And so to give you my background, my name is Steven Jasmine. I'm a merchant banker based in Atlanta, Georgia, and living down in Georgetown Ghana as well, building a merchant bank and asset management practice to participate in the new country that's being developed as a result of the large oil boom here in Guyana.
Greg Poapst: Great. So I guess starting at the beginning, you know, you're a graduate of the Emory's business school and what did you do right after graduating? What kind of role or job that you kind of participate in?
Steven Jasmin: Yeah, so I went to the Goldsboro to the business school at Emory University and graduated in 2005 with my undergrad in bachelor in business administration. And while I was at Emory, I had met some great adjunct lecturers and professors who were actually out working in the finance fields and they were merchant bankers themselves and the investment bankers doing their own transactions essentially, and being their own asset manager for their clients and partners. And so I decided that I wanted to follow that non-traditional path instead of going the route that most of my classmates went and go into one of the bulge bracket banks and working your way up through the process. I had run a business all through college that I sold when I graduated and I formed a partnership with my partner and we launched a fortune 500 management consulting company, a whole flashpoint group. And so Delta airlines were one of our first clients. They were in the middle of bankruptcy. And so at the age of 21, we raised three and a half million dollars in debt and equity and launched the business and grew to about 40 full-time employees pretty much overnight. And so it was quite the experience and it was quite a privilege, honestly.
Greg Poapst: Great. So sounds like entrepreneurial spirit kind of runs in your veins.
Steven Jasmin: Absolutely. I've, I've always kind of, I was fortunate that I had a career in IT before I got into Emory and went to college and during the.com bomb. And so I knew what that role consisted of working for someone else and trading time for money. But I was always wanted to kind of do my own thing and blaze my own path and be responsible to myself. So since I've graduated from Emory, I've pretty much constantly worked for myself as a merchant banker and an investment banker with my partners. Great.
Greg Poapst: What was it like running your own firm? You know, growing it to, you said 40 employees and kind of building that business.
Steven Jasmin: It was a great learning experience. You know, when you go through it at the time, you don't realize how lucky you are and you don't realize how serious things are, is it just kind of happens and you're so caught up in the moment. You don't really appreciate it, but unfortunately, you know, or fortunately we ran into some struggles in our growth cycle and the recession in eight, no nine when the financial markets flops. So it didn't matter that, you know, we were consultants of record with companies like Delta airlines, Coca-Cola Johnson and Johnson, and working with all these major boardrooms. And she suite executives from these companies, you know, we still had to build and grow business and there was a steep learning curve and that we had to go through and there were mistakes made and lessons learned and opportunities passed, but at the same token, you know, that's when you really truly understand how the business of business works, if that makes sense. And so it really helped us to grow as asset managers and investors with our own investments in our portfolios that we have always had on the alternative investment side. So with that, you know, it enabled us to, because we had the meteoric rise and kind of the meteoric fall in a very condensed period in the grand scheme of things, we were able to kind of get a lot more experience in the long-term in a very short amount of time, which then allowed us to as fail forward as we've been able to do and succeed much larger over the past 10 years since the company.
Greg Poapst: Great. Yeah. And so maybe, touch on, you know, what kind of, what came next for you, um, you know, throughout your career. I know now, you know, in 2017 started the Guyana kind of endeavor and, you know, between that time you, I'll let you fill in that gap.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah. Yeah. So, and 2009, 2010, I went out and got my investment banking licenses worked for a couple of boutique investment banks ended up, um, getting my 79 and my 63. And then from there, we actually opened up and relaunched flashpoint, but focused it more on the oil industry, the oil and gas sector down in Louisiana, the offshore oil and gas sector specifically. And so with that, we started to build a practice that really focused on working with bringing our talents and expertise from working with the fortune 500 clients in the best practices down to multi-generational family owned companies, who for lack of a better head CFOs that were at more bookkeepers CFOs. And so that enabled us to create a lot of value and help grow those companies, you know, on a fee for service basis. And then also, help them realign their alternative investment portfolio to more credit worthy investments and opportunities so that they could actually see a return on their business besides their friendly owned business.
Greg Poapst: Great. Sounds interesting. And so when you mean, you're talking to these families oil and gas and basically providing an institutional mindset to their business and their investments, were you sort of the closest sort of advisor to them and did they have their own financial advisors and how did that work?
Steven Jasmin: Yeah, so we would come in with sort of a bang capital being consulting model. And so our focus was always, we don't want to disturb your multi-generational business, let us help run it more efficiently and bring that institutional experience to bear. And then let's see how we can help grow your alternative investments and really grow your other relationships. To your point there is a very unique relationship that comes in when you're an asset manager working directly as a family office advisor, fractional family, office manager for these families and the lines of business and friendship get blurred and professionalism is always a struggle. And client coverage becomes one of your biggest challenges as you look to grow the business and because you can't help, but get emotionally entangled into the situation. It's your job is as an asset managers to be a counsel to the family and to protect their, their interests, but you're also there to help guide them along. And you can, if you're passionate about what you do, you can't help invest yourself in their success and, and take their losses as your losses as well. And so it was a real learning experience and a great opportunity to kind of grow the, the soft side of the banking asset management practice, if you will.
Greg Poapst: Yeah, it makes sense. And there's, there's some things I guess he just can't learn from a from a textbook, right. And it's just sort of one of those things where the relationship aspect is, is as much as important as investment returns and management efficiencies really.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah, absolutely. It's all about at the end of the day managing the client's expectation and bringing them to reality and guiding them along and being there to catch them when they fall too. Because a lot of times despite being a counselor to an advisor, to successful fortune 500 boardrooms and CEOs and these families, they're going to do what they want to do at the end of the day, we're here to provide the guidance and give them the options but fundamentally they're in control and they have to take the path that's meant for them. And sometimes that means us sitting back and letting them go down the wrong path, but knowing that we'll be there to help catch them when they decide to bring us back in. Does that make sense?
Greg Poapst: Absolutely. So I can't help, but wonder, with oil and gas families, it's a bit of a boom or bust area in some ways. And with that volatility is, I'm assuming that's when, when you're talking about the, the good times and the bad times, you know, with these families and with your clients and business endeavors, and then obviously throughout 2015, 2000, you know, I think it was late 2015 with the oil kind of crash, the pricing crashed, and it's led us to this entirely new landscape when it comes to oil and gas. How did that kind of fit into your whole business model? And did you, did you see any turnover new clients or old clients coming in or losing?
Steven Jasmin: Yeah, no great point. In the downturn and 14, beginning of 15, we actually saw our practice grew because there were more families that needed our council and were in over their heads. And so we actually took on more clients and got exposed to bigger opportunities. I myself became a chief restructuring officer for some of these families where we would help them navigate the bankruptcy waters and advise and manage the legal teams and the finance teams that were helping go through this process and negotiate with the creditors and sell off their assets. And ironically, that's how I actually ended up down here in Guyana was that I was selling all of our families, as you know; we're part of the offshore oil and gas industry. And so some of them own these big boats that they use as tractor trailers for the oil and gas services industry essentially.
Steven Jasmin: And so when they're not working and their highest and best use in the oil and gas sector, they're really good to help transport goods throughout the Caribbean. And so as when I was in charge of liquidating, some of those assets, we ended up starting to liquidate them to different families throughout the Caribbean. And that's where I learned topped my way down to Guyana and saw the opportunity of what I knew because of my relationships in the oil and gas industry was going to be a huge bull run for the country are bound with the amount of natural resources that they had discovered through Exxon's discovery in 2015. So when I got here in June of two 17, they had found 2 billion barrels and here we are, 38 months later, never really left. And now they're up to over 10 billion barrels and across the entire resource, it's probably 15 to 25 billion barrels is what they believe. And so that's a pretty big growth that's coming.
Greg Poapst: Absolutely. Yeah. That's a big huge amount of growth and a huge discovery. And you know I'm sure some of the listeners will probably go and look it up after and read about it because it was kind of exciting to me. And it does make sense when you look at obviously Venezuela has been massive oil producer for years and, and the geographic kind of proximity to Guyana as kind of makes sense. It’s kind of a surprise that they didn't find it earlier. Right. And maybe that's something to do with the infrastructure there and what you're trying to achieve and trying to change.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah. Well, and to your point, the kind of guests to get a bit nerdy for a second, but while that's found in Guyana is different from Venezuela; Venezuela is more of an onshore play. It's the heavy crude oil that's been found here in Guyana is, has a specific gravity of between 31 and 33. So it's ultra-low sulfur crude, which is cheaper to refine and higher in demand and is what the world is trending towards a needs, quite frankly. And so with the low cost of production being analysts publicly, we'll say 30 to 35 a barrel by the time we get all in down here they're going to have 10 F PSOs over the next decade. And each one of those up PSOs will be producing anywhere from one to 200,000 barrels a day. And so the country will be producing 2 million barrels a day, roughly the next 10 years, and for a country that only has 750,000 people that's really going to change the dynamic of the entire hemisphere. And so we're in the middle of that and we're excited to be a part of that. But it's a large part is that it's just been an offshore resource. I mean, everyone always joked that Eldorado was in Guyana, the lost city of gold, and ironically, the Eldorado has been found, it was just a hundred miles off shore guy on a, not in Guyana. And it was black gold instead of real gold. Not that there's not a golden industry here, but the black, old is much, much larger.
Greg Poapst: Yeah, absolutely. So what do you see for the future of Guyana? I guess you kind of touched on that and the more importantly the future of your company as C3 what are you working on now in terms of trying to build this infrastructure in, in Guyana and raise capital and get investors interested?
Steven Jasmin: Absolutely. So we already are engaged on several projects that are kind of, if you will, in stealth mode. And so we're, we're moving through the process of announcing that, and then the funding, the corresponding funding parts that are coming with it. So our practice here in Guyana is structured as a merchant bank. And so we act as an independent sponsor across all the alternative investment asset classes. And so, you know if someone wants to build a hotel, they come to us and say, hey, we're looking to build a hotel. We've got land, or we want to invest in one. And we put the deal together and we manage it as global asset manager. And so we've got a pipeline of projects we've already had some wins, and then we've got some projects coming down the pike. And for us, we're looking to essentially be the boots on the ground asset manager, because when you work in these frontier markets, there's always a disconnect between the local boots on the ground and the international capital that's trying to come in and they really need to have a salient point of contact who is experienced, who knows enough of the local politics and the local way of doing business and the local mindset and culture, which is what my partners and I have spent the past 38 months focused on developing here in Guyana, and then also working enabled to speak to the international asset managers who are looking to deploy capital and want to partner with us to be the representatives down here, working to make sure the projects are growing and are successful and not just getting bottlenecked or going the wrong direction
Greg Poapst: If you will. Yeah, that makes sense. I know from my side, if I was an investor looking at investing Guyana, one of the big, big barriers to that entry would be the perceived risk or the amount of risk in, in politics and geopolitical risk. And it's sounds kind of weird to say now in the whole world, sort of this geopolitical risk to some extent, but it really, I think would only make sense if you find someone, as you said, boots on the ground that you clearly trust and can, can really know that that has your best interest and can put forth the effort and making connections and, and doing due diligence.
Steven Jasmin: Absolutely well, and that's a big part of value add that we add as an asset manager, but it's also what we're passionate about. And so for us, it's you have to control the supply chain in these frontier markets. And that goes all the way from capital formation and allocation all the way down to the asset management side. So our core model that we've always my partners and I have always focused on, has been the asset management and the actual execution, unlike most fund managers who just write checks and expect other people to watch it we roll up our sleeves and get in the weeds and take that risk on ourselves. And you get a lot more upside for that, but then you got to make sure that you've got the right team and the right people. And there's a lot of overhead of malt with that as well from a compliance standpoint.
Greg Poapst: Yeah, absolutely makes sense. So you're doing asset management of hotels and construction and, and some real estate development. I understand. And what brought you into that side of it? And I'm sure there's a story there and real estate development.
Steven Jasmin: So growing up my best friend's father, um, who I've never actually met, believe it or not, but, uh, was one of the first commercial real estate developers and built the first commercial real estate firm in Moscow when the wall fell. And so growing up and hearing my best friend talk about his dad and all of his crazy stories and all of his wild antics he did very well for himself launching the first Western style commercial real estate firm in Russia. And so when I came down to Guyana, you know, 38 months ago with my partners, the first thing we launched was Accuride properties, our commercial real estate division. And it was basically following the playbook of what my best friend's father had done, who had heard anecdotally done, but definitely have been very successful with it. And I thought, you know what? I think that's a great place to start. And then our frontier market to this day, 38 months later, Guyana's still does not have any true classy office space yet, you know? And so the growth in the real estate market and the establishment of the, the bar, if you will being raised to international building code standards and having the right mechanical and electrical and plumbing and life safety systems and doing everything so that once again, the international asset managers can actually invest in these assets because they're investment grade at that point, that's what we need. And so that was the first area of focus that I decided to, to work on. And that's kind of the cornerstone of what we've been building because infrastructure needs to be developed, price of power needs to come down. There are a lot of different things that have to happen, but it honestly all centers around developing a country that people want to work in and doing that is through helping develop the real estate that the country needs.
Greg Poapst: Yeah, it makes sense. So it's kind of like, I feel like your asset management background, this real estate development piece and money raising and, and, you know, boots on the ground, all of it kind of points to you're trying to help build that infrastructure in Guyana, which some people would classify it as, as sort of an impact investment as well. Right. Where you're trying to all of this obviously benefits you and your company and, and, and the participants all along the way and the different pieces, but also the people of Guyana.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah. Well, fundamentally, that's always been one of my core items of focus is that people talk about local content in these emerging markets, and it's not just in the oil and gas sector that local content needs to be focused on it's throughout the entire country, it's called capacity building. And one of the things that I'm eager to do, we wouldn't have done is that I'm able to mentor, I was privileged to be able to lecture at the university of Guyana with one of the professors here and they're doing some of those things. I've been able to kind of give back to the community and, and help people that want to learn, get on board and become a part of what we're building because the Guyana of today and the downloads and years from now are going to be two entirely different worlds.
Steven Jasmin: Uh, no one can even comprehend myself included quite frankly. I mean, just to put things in perspective, pre COVID the IMF predicted that Guyana would have a real GDP growth rate of, I believe at 85.6% and post COVID, we're still looking at 53% roughly is what the IMF came back with. And that's when, you know, the rest of the first world in developed countries are all looking at negative, real growth. And so when you enter a period, like COVID all of a sudden, now we're positioned in a market where you know that a new hospital needs to be built. You know, that bridges need to be built. You know, do you need another hospital in a suburb of New York? Maybe, maybe not, but you definitely need one here. Yes. Do you need another hotel? Well, there are only two internationally flagged hotels in Guyana. You know, we're not looking to build a beach resort. That's not what we do, but in Guyana right now, but we're going to be building what the country needs to move forward and then develop the capacity with the local partners. And the local guy needs to actually run these businesses and grow these businesses and run them at the transparency required for the international investment community who want to participate and get access to the market.
Greg Poapst: Great. So how much do you think time and money is really needed for Guyana to become a powerhouse in the Caribbean? It's it seems like obviously it takes time to build all of that infrastructure and all of the build hospitals and build bridges and build the oil and gas, but also billions of dollars to some extent, right.
Steven Jasmin: So, you know, and that's part of the problem is that there's a disconnect in the market right now. I've got asset managers and fund managers wanting to come up to me and say, Hey when you got a hundred million dollar tickets and order books going, you know, $200 million billion dollar order books, we'd love to stroke a check. But the reality is, is that Guyana doesn't have the capacity right now to swallow those investments. It just doesn't. And so we need to kind of work into it over time and it'll happen but the one thing is, is with technology and democratization of the world and transparency the oil field in Guyana came online and under five years from the first discovery, the actual production, and it came in a billion dollars under budget as well, which is unheard of in the offshore oil and gas exploration industry. And so it all kinds of records, and so with that kind of forward-leaning momentum and especially entering what I believe is going to be a bear market or some sort of depression recession over the next 24 to 36 months because of COVID and the worldwide economic slowdown and the amount of money that the fed is unlocking with $6 trillion being released between now and election day in the United States. You know, all of that money is looking for homes for a home where can be put to work. And so I think in some instances it's actually going to accelerate the development of Guyana, because any time, if you look back at the, oh eight recession where did all the money go? It went into commodities and it went into frontier markets in the past growth cycle, it was the bricks, Brazil, Russia, India, and China. And now Brazil is looking to reposition a lot of their capital here in Guyana. And, you know, that's the shift that happens over a decade, but a decade later now Guyana is sitting in that sweet spot and, but got the differences, this guy on as a country of 750,000 people with, and that entire population lives across maybe eight cities in the entire country for the most part. And so it's a very small amount of impact can make a great change in the average life, the average day of every citizen in the country.
Greg Poapst: Yeah. Very interesting. I feel like the world doesn't know as much about Guyana as they should at this point.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah. It's a story that's getting told and things always start with the oil and gas sector and part of it is that like all emerging oil economies, which got a falls under there's the political risks that you alluded to as of yesterday, a peaceful transition of government occurred, um, parliament was called for the first time and 246 days, the 12th session of parliament was called. And to put that in perspective the country's only 50 years old and they've only had 12 different sessions of parliament, you know? And so the country is still a relatively new country. Post-colonialism it used to be a former British colony. And so with that, you take a young country with a big checkbook now, all of a sudden, and it's gonna create a lot of issues and it's going to create a lot of fear and that's what we're here to help mitigate and work with foreign direct investors and the local business community and the private sector to bridge that gap because there is a lot of disconnect there. And so we're here to help turn that into a success.
Greg Poapst: Great. So what, what exactly has it been like living in Guyana, you've been there for 36 months, 38 months.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah. So it's bigger than life, you know? Yeah. No, it's honestly pretty quiet it's a small country, everyone knows everyone's business. So it's very funny to go around and, you know, there's like all frontier markets, you know, there's 10 or so different families that kinda run the place. And so I spent the past 38 months getting to know them all and figuring out which ones I wanted to be in business with and which ones wanted to wanted help because a lot of people don't need help necessarily, or don't want the help. And so we've been working through the process of finding the right partners and, and getting to understand it day to day it's very similar to America, you know what I mean?
Steven Jasmin: I've got a fiber internet connection here in my house in downtown Georgetown, you know what I mean? And so it's at some levels it's very similar, but then on other levels it's completely different, because they don't even have a McDonald's yet, you know? And so there's still, it's a blank slate. And the labor is extremely cheap here. And so, you know, a lot of mechanic realization that we see in first world countries, it doesn't make sense to go that route because it's cheaper just to throw resources and bodies at it quite frankly, than to bring in those tools because the growth has never been there to dictate it. And so we believe that's where some of these real opportunities lie for the country as it grows. And so for us it's been just immersing ourselves in the environment, building a reputation and also kind of staying behind the scenes and not getting caught up in the, the tribalism of Guyana and the local political scene, if you will, because ultimately we're bankers and we're here to help create wealth, both for the guy, Guyanese the country, as well as the international investors. And that's what our real focus is. And so a lot of what we've done has been more standing back and observing and learning and figuring out how the is played down here so that we can be the leading asset manager that understands how to do it so that we can achieve the greatest alpha, if you will.
Greg Poapst: It's very exciting. So speaking of exciting what's the most exciting, you know, opportunity] that you're seeing right now that you can divulge, I know that some of them are in top secret mode, but what's the most exciting thing you're working on these days?
Steven Jasmin: Yeah, so I believe that there's a kind of a pan Caribbean investment community that wants to get access to Guyana. And so we're in discussions and exploring the potential of opening a broker dealer in Jamaica to serve as kind of the financial services back office for SC3 as well as to provide a conduit through a more regulated in an established market to allow the public equity markets, to gain access to the frontier market of Guyana much earlier in the growth cycle. And so with that, we're really excited about that. You know, Jamaica right now has an election going on. They need to expand regionally both with their stock exchange as well as their financial services sector. And so I'm very excited to, to be looking at opening up an office in a broker dealer in Jamaica to serve as kind of that platform and conduit for the international investment community to get access to Guyana much earlier in the investment cycle than they normally would. As well as allow the regional and local investors access to it through that conduit, if you will.
Greg Poapst: Great. So I guess last main question here. What advice would you give to investors, you know, high net worth and otherwise that are looking to participate in the broader Caribbean markets where would they look or where, where would you look if you were an investor trying to get you don't want to be an active investor boots on the ground, but you just want some exposure.
Steven Jasmin: Yeah. Well, one it's about finding the market that kind of corresponds with what you're trying to accomplish and what your investment goals are. And also it's running the right asset manager that has your interest at heart and is a good steward of capital and principle. I believe you've got to do your homework and research no matter what and you really got to perform your due diligence as an asset manager looking to fund other asset managers or as an LP looking to invest in asset managers. But at the end of the day, it's the old adage data. He who has the gold rules. And so we've positioned ourselves to be very nimble and be able to mold ourselves to what the different partners want us to focus on. And we can build the teams to execute and deliver on what their goals and objectives are. And I think that's what differentiates us from the Caribbean. They should be looking for, especially throughout the Caribbean when you're analyzing potential investments; you've got to look at the macro as well as the micro. And so when you're looking at the macro you want to put your money where the money's going to grow, even if the asset managers stumbles candidly, and that's just common sense, right? And so when you do that, you want to go in and focus and say, okay, well, if you look at the Caribbean as a whole, and it's going to have negative GDP growth, especially when tied to inflation with the amount of money that's going to be printed, when it is printed, then let's find the market that has that growth. That way we can hedge the downside of it, because if the whole market's growing, then all asset values is going to go up regardless of whether or not our particular is successful. Does that make sense?
Greg Poapst: Absolutely. Yeah. And definitely makes sense. And it's, it's definitely a unique, exciting opportunity that, that you guys are working on at, at Sc3 and it's going to be an exciting time for you and for your investors.
Steven Jasmin: Absolutely. And with that we're really just excited to see the people of Guyana and the country grow as a result of this, because I believe there's currently kind of a power vacuum, both in the Caribbean Central America and South America. And I believe that Guyana is quickly going to fill that void because it is more of a Gulf coast country on its forward looking trajectory. And I don't believe that there's any other country in this hemisphere right now that is on the same growth path that Guyana is. And so when I look to see how w what our strategic plans are and what our core assets and key assets that we're looking to get involved in, we're looking to some of the models and best practices that have come out of some of the Gulf coast countries as they went through their growth cycle in oil and gas. And so I've been fortunate to have some clients and families I work with out of the Middle East. And so I've seen and learned quite a bit through that process. And I'm taking some of those best practices as an asset manager down here to Guyana, because that's where this, we could become Dubai of central South America and the Caribbean. I mean, there's more oil wealth per capita in Guyana, offshore oil, wealth per capita in Guyana than any other words, any other country in the world and so, and there's only 20 countries in the world that produce a million barrels, a day of oil, and Guyana is going to be one of them inside of the next five years. And so with that there's a lot of opportunity. There's a lot of Chris that comes with that. And a lot of struggles that'll be there. It's not going to be easy, but we're here for the long-term and we're here to see everyone succeed, including ourselves in our investors.
Greg Poapst: Great. Well, thanks Steve, for joining the fund views podcast, it was a very exciting episode and definitely a unique as you're not directly a fund manager, Breton asset manager, merchant banker, and a lot of other exciting, exciting things are now. So really appreciate the time and I'm sure our listeners will as well. They'll, you know, appreciate a little bit of a change from the traditional fund managers and more into something, a little different.
Steven Jasmin: Excellent. Well, thanks for having me, Greg, and look forward to seeing the podcast grow. Congratulations!
Greg Poapst: Thanks. And that's it for today's show. I hope you found it insightful and entertaining. If you did give us a like, follow or subscribe on your favorite streaming or social media platform at fund views, podcast, or fund viewspodcast.com till next time.